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  #1  
Old 10-10-2014, 05:44 PM
emount emount is offline
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Default Need Help understanding engraving styles

In some pre WWII catalogs Walther engraved deluxe pistols were offered in three styles: "Ornement", "Oal Leaf", and "English" Do these three engraved pistols represent the three styles? I would appreciate any input.

Thanks, Earl
Attached Images
File Type: jpg M9 factory engraved nickel pearl.jpg (80.5 KB, 0 views)
File Type: jpg M9 factory engraved gold pearl.jpg (66.7 KB, 0 views)
File Type: jpg walthe english engraving.jpg (69.6 KB, 0 views)
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  #2  
Old 10-10-2014, 10:43 PM
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Roger Bleile Roger Bleile is offline
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

Earl,

The first pistol on the left is engraved in what German engravers call "Grund Englisch" that style is also known as "neuenglische Arabesken." American engravers call it "German Scroll." The gold plated pistol is in the oak leaf style that is known in German speaking countries as " Eichenlaubornament." The pistol on the right is engraved in what English speaking engravers call English scroll. German engravers call it "Druck Englische Arabesken" or "Altenglische Arabesken." The word "ornament" means the same thing in German and English.

Is your catalog in German or English? If in English, it is a matter of translation and the use of terms meant to appeal to customers.

If you are interested in learning the terminology used by engravers of various countries, click on the link under my signature or click on the word Glossary in red at the top of the page.
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  #3  
Old 10-11-2014, 05:38 PM
emount emount is offline
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

Roger,

Thank you for the explanation and clarification. I have studied over a dozen catalogs in several languages from the 1920's and 1930's which advertised engraved ("deluxe" or "Luxury") Walther pistols. Most refer to the engraving simply as "rich" but a German language GECO catalog from 1937 offered three engraving options: "Ornamenten, Eichenlaub, oder engliche" Which I translated into Ornament, Oakleaf or English.

I have referred to your Glossary many times. It is packed with a great information. I appreciate your support.

Regards,

Earl
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Old 10-11-2014, 05:43 PM
emount emount is offline
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

Here is another engraved Walther and I do not know how to describe the "style of engraving". I would appreciate any comments.

Thanks, Earl
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File Type: jpg 9858179_1.jpg (43.1 KB, 0 views)
File Type: jpg 9858179_2.jpg (43.6 KB, 0 views)
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  #5  
Old 10-11-2014, 10:29 PM
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Roger Bleile Roger Bleile is offline
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

I really like that one. The closest I can come to an established ornamental style is "distelornament" in German. In English we would call it thistle ornament. I believe the engraving is original to that gun but a very uncommon style. It may have been a custom order.

Apparently you are a collector of Model 9 Walthers. Here are a few pics of one engraved, post war, by the well known German engraver Claus Willig. This one was done in typical "German scroll" or "druck Englische." I might add that this gun was up for auction a couple of years ago and the auctioneer misstated that this gun was owned by a C, Willig who must have been an important person in Hitler's regime. I wrote to them and advised who Willig is and that he could have hardly been an important Nazi as he was only six years old when the war ended. Nevertheless, they did not change the description on their web site.

By the way, my understanding of these German engraving terms is as explained to me by Andreas Amthor, who is one of the masters at the Berufsfachschule Büchsenmacher & Graveure in Suhl, Germany.
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Old 10-12-2014, 08:00 AM
emount emount is offline
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

Thank you Roger.
I will include this information in an article that I am writing about "deluxe" or "Luxury" Walther Model 9 pistols.

This Forum has been a great help to me in learning to understand enough about engraved Walther pistols to know the difference between the early ones and those that have been recently worked on.

Regards,

Earl
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  #7  
Old 10-12-2014, 09:32 PM
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Roger Bleile Roger Bleile is offline
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

Earl,

You are welcome. I would be interested in reading your article. In the interim, if I can be of assistance, let me know. I also have a few more images of engraved model 9s.

RB
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http://www.engravingglossary.com/
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  #8  
Old 10-14-2014, 04:24 PM
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Default Re: Need Help understanding engraving styles

Roger,

I sent you a Private Message concerning sending you a copy of the Article.

Thanks, Earl
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